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Date: 10/5/2001 9:38:00 PM
From Authorid: 3688
firstborn..i generally stay away from debates...but that website is satire....its not at all a serious site...not sure if you are aware or not so i just wanted to say that...take care :)  |
Date: 10/5/2001 9:45:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thanks for that information, but I've came across many sites like this that have said the same thing. They all cant be satire or serious, thanks for stopping by and may God bless.  |
Date: 10/5/2001 9:46:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Here we go again.. *spins his sword around in a figure 8*  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 9:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
i guess I could agree with you since i gave you the link, but this isnt the most weird or disturbing thing i have run into today :) |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:01:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Hi, huma, if you have more share it with us. love mom |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:04:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
2 words: SPANISH INQUISITION! Remembering what the Holly Fathers did in the name of Church in the dark ages! All they needed was one book! THE BIBLE! Does that make the BIBLE a bad book?  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:05:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
I guess you missed my big debate about harry potter mom, i'll get you A link later, but we had at least 338 replies to story |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:05:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
There was no bible in the dark ages, in fact, during the dark ages there was crude english, and chinese writing only. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:07:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Star Gazer.. yeesh after the printing press was invented that was when they compiled the many books of the bible, the bible is no book.. it is a ton of books placed together |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
Forgive me if i didnt make myself more clear , but the question remains... Call it a religious dark age! If you will! |
Date: 10/5/2001 10:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 40194
There is no way that any of those quotes are in any way true. Anyway, Harry Potter celebrates CHRISTmas...  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:11:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
there t'was very few bibles, and eat would be 10 feet high there were very few of them, and they only had a few of the books, they were hand copied, the dark ages refers to the age before mass production of books.. IE all books were written by monks.. and each monk of each denomination hand copies them.. buddhist.. christian.. catholic.. ect... |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:12:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
the yule tree is a sign of the occult, therefore he is celebrating it under the occult, hahaha.. a time of rebirth before the spring air comes in, that is what he is celebrating.. not in christianity, but then again.. he would be a dedicated norseman |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:13:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
When i mention Spanish Inquisition that should have told you about the time period . Unless you are trying to avoid the question? |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
and perhaps.. a norse sorcerer.. summoning Odin with Grunge Lance and Steel Bladed Sword -Materia Seller, FF7 (man that fit right into my arguement) |
Date: 10/5/2001 10:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 24405
Oh please. This is just a pile of crap written by angry ignorant people pasted tpgether. I can almost see right throuhg it, it's so fake. I find it all hard to believe. "Suck the greasy **** of the Dark Lord?" Oh, come on..  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:15:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
what Spanish Inquisition, are you saying there are spanyards on a quest for the bible? please rephrase the question.. I can't concentrate with this caffine.. are you trying to avoid my answer? the age of darkness.. is the age before mass production of books... do i have to talk about the monks again? |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:16:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Jennir, I don't know what to say.. perhaps if firstborn responds.. well.. *huma steps back* no opinion of that Jennir |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:16:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
I'm just tryin to defend my mother.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:18:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
oh mother.. why must thy persist, doth thou really worry that much for the readers of harry potter? |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:19:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
"Here we go again. IF you get mad, I'm sorry." -Firstborn,16671 |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:20:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
The rape , destruction of property and mass murder in the european countries , orchestrated by one called Torquemada , aided by the pope in an effort to gain riches for the church. Heck with the monks,pick up a history book ! |
Date: 10/5/2001 10:20:00 PM
From Authorid: 42539
ok please Harry Potter is just a book about witchcraft so what most poeple that belive in witchcraft will tell you they do not worship a "dark lord"  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:21:00 PM
From Authorid: 40194
this is SO FAKE. I went to the onion.com and looked at some of the other things.. THIS IS NOT A REAL STORY. SO do NOT believe this.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:22:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
Give me a break! Its a kids book! |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Obviously that is Catholic, I'll get back to you on the core subject, but the bible is not a catholic book, it is a book of all denominations, if you read it, you'll find it directing no attention to anyone but the ancient egyption faith and the jewish faith.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:24:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Well Star Gazer; My mom wrote this story, So I must side with family.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:24:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
I give up mother.. you fight this.. :) i'll check back tomarrow, for now i got to go to sleep |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:27:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
http://internettrash.com/users/torquemada/ , i suggest you visit this website, as you see, www.internetTRASH.com , its trash.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:27:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
Inquisition, judicial institution, established by the papacy in the Middle Ages, charged with seeking out, trying, and sentencing persons guilty of heresy. In the early church the usual penalty for heresy was excommunication. With the establishment of Christianity as the state religion by the Roman emperors in the 4th century, heretics came to be considered enemies of the state, especially when violence and the disturbance of public order were involved. St. Augustine gave a somewhat reluctant approval to action by the state against heretics, but the church generally disapproved of coercion and physical penalties. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
The most serious business of the tribunal, in the line of its proper functions, was with the apostasy of the Jewish New Christians. From the very foundation of the colonies . . . restrictions were laid on the emigration of Conversos and a law of 1543, preserved in the Recopilacion, orders that search be made for all descendants of Jews who were to be rigorously expelled. In spite, however, of the jealous care observed to preserve the colonies from all danger of Jewish infection, the commercial attractions were so powerful that the New Christians eluded all precautions. At first, however, they occupied but a small portion of the energies of the tribunal. . . . The first appearance of Jews is in the auto of October 29, 1581, when Manuel Upez, a Portuguese, was reconciled with confiscation and perpetual prison, and Diego de la Rosa, described as a native of Quito, was required to abjure de levi and was exiled - showing that the evidence against him was very dubious. . . . The conquest of Portugal, in 1580, had led to a large emigration to Castile, where Portuguese soon became synonymous with Judaizer, and this was beginning to make itself manifest in the colonies. The auto of December 17, 1595, gave impressive evidence of this. Five Portuguese - Juan Méndez, Antonio Núñez, Juan López, Francisco Báez and Manuel Rodriguez - were reconciled. Another, Herman Jorje, had died during trial and his memory was not prosecuted. There were also four martyrs. Jorje Núñez, denied until he was tied upon the rack; he then confessed and refused to be converted, but after his sentence of relaxation was read he weakened and was strangled before burning. Francisco Rodríguez endured torture without confessing; when threatened with repetition he endeavored unsuccessfully to commit suicide; he was voted to relaxation with torture in caput alienum, and under it he accused several persons but revoked at ratification. He was pertinacious to the last and was burnt alive. Juan Fernández was relaxed, although insane; the Suprema expressed doubts whether he had intelligence enough to render him responsible. Pedro de Contreras had been tortured for confession and again in caput alienum; he denied Judaism throughout and was relaxed as a negativo; at the auto he manifested great devotion to a crucifix and presumably was strangled; in all probability he was really a Christian. . . . In 1626 there commenced a trial which illustrates forcibly the inexorable discipline of the Church, rendering it the supreme duty of the Christian to persecute and destroy all heresy. Francisco Maldonado de Silva was a surgeon of high repute in Concepcion de Chile. He was of Portuguese descent. His father had suffered in the Inquisition, had been reconciled and brought up his children, two girls and a boy, as Christians. Francisco was a good Catholic until at the age of 18, he chanced to read the Scrutinium Scripturarum of Pablo de Santa Maria, Bishop of Búrgos - a controversial work written for the conversion of Jews. So far from confirming him in the faith it raised doubts leading him to consult his father, who told him to study the Bible and instructed him in the Law of Moses. He became an ardent convert to Judaism, but kept his secret from his mother and two sisters and from his wife, for he was married and had a child, and his wife was pregnant when he was arrested. During her absence, a year or two before, he bad circumcised himself. At the age of 35, considering that his sister Isabel who was about 33, was mature enough for religious independence, he revealed his secret to her and endeavored to convert her, but in vain, and he was impervious to her entreaties to abandon his faith. They seem to have been tenderly attached to each other; he was her sole support as well as that of her mother and sister, but she could not escape the necessity of communicating the facts in confession to her confessor. The prescriptions of the Church were absolute; no family ties relieved one from the obligation of denouncing heresy, and she could not hope for sacramental absolution without discharging the duty. We can picture to ourselves the torment of that agonized soul as she nerved herself to the awful duty which could cost her a lifetime of remorse and misery when she obeyed her confessor's commands and denounced her brother to the Inquisition. The warrant for his arrest was issued December 12, 1626, and executed at Concepcion April 29, 1627. His friend, the Dominican Fray Diego de Ureña, visited him in his place of confinement, May 2, and sought to convert him, but he was resolved to die in the faith in which his father had died. So when transferred to Santiago, the Augustinian Fray Alonso de Almeida made similar efforts with like ill-success; he knew that he should die for the faith, he had never spoken to any one but his sister and she had betrayed him. He was received in Lima July 23d and was admitted to an audience the same day. When required to swear on the cross he refused, saying that he was a Jew and would live and die as such; if he had to swear it would be by the living God, the God of Israel. His trial went on through all the customary formalities, protracted by the repeated conferences held with theologians who endeavored to convince him of his errors. Eleven of these were held without weakening his pertinacity until, on January 26, 1633, the consulta de fe unanimously condemned him to relaxation. A long sickness followed, caused by a fast of eighty days which had reduced him almost to a skeleton covered with sores. On convalescing, he asked for another conference, to solve the doubts which he had drawn up in writing. It was held June 26, 1634, and left him as pertinacious as ever. Meanwhile the prison was filling with Judaizers, of whom a number had been discovered in Lima. He asked for maize husks in place of his ration of bread, and with them made a rope by which he escaped through a window and visited two neighboring cells, urging the prisoners to be steadfast in their law; they denounced him and he made no secret of it, confessing freely what he had done. It was a mercy of God, we are told, that his prolonged fast had rendered him deaf, or he would have learned much from them of what had been going on. The tribunal was so preoccupied, with the numerous trials on foot at the time, that Maldonado was left undisturbed, awaiting the general auto that was to follow. We hear nothing more until, after an interval of four years, a thirteenth conference was held at his request, November 12, 1638. It was as fruitless as its predecessors and, at its conclusion, he produced two books (each of them of more than a hundred leaves), made with marvellous ingenuity out of scraps of paper and written with ink made of charcoal and pens cut out of egg-shells with a knife fashioned from a nail, which he said he delivered up for the discharge of his conscience. Then on December 9th and 10th were held two more conferences in which his pertinacity remained unshaken. The long tragedy was now drawing to an end after an imprisonment which had lasted for nearly thirteen years. He was brought out in the great auto of January 23, 1639, where, when the sentences of relaxation were read, a sudden whirlwind tore away the awning and, looking up, he exclaimed "The God of Israel does this to look upon me face to face!" He was unshrinking to the last and was burnt alive a true martyr to his faith. His two paper books were hung around his neck to burn with him and assist in burning him. This auto of 1639, the greatest that had as yet been held in the New World, was the culmination of the "complicidad grande" - the name given by the inquisitors to a number of Judaizers whom they had discovered. As they described the situation, in a report of 1636, large numbers of Portuguese had entered the kingdom by way of Buenos Ayres, Brazil, Mexico, Granada and Puerto Bello, thus increasing the already numerous bands of their compatriots. They became masters of the commerce of the kingdom; from brocade to sack-cloth, from diamonds to cumin seed, everything passed through their hands; the Castilian who had not a Portuguese partner could look for no success in trade. They would buy the cargoes of whole fleets with the fictitious credits which they exchanged, thus rendering capital unnecessary, and would distribute the merchandise throughout the land by their agents, who were likewise Portuguese, and their capacity developed until, in 1634, they negotiated for the farming of the royal customs. In August, 1634, Joan de Salazar, a merchant, denounced to the Inquisition Antonio Cordero, clerk of a trader from Seville, because he refused to make a sale on a Saturday. On another occasion, going to his store on a Friday morning, he found Cordero breakfasting on a piece of bread and an apple and, on asking him whether he had not better take a rasher of bacon, Cordero replied "Must I eat what my father and grandfather never ate?" The evidence was weak and no immediate action was taken, but, in October, the commissioners were instructed secretly to ascertain and report the number of Portuguese in their several districts. The matter rested and, as nothing new was developed, in March, 1635, the evidence against Cordero was laid before a consulta de fe and it was resolved to arrest him secretly, without sequestration, so that the hand of the Inquisition might not be apparent. Bartolomé de Larrea, a familiar, called on him, April 2d, under pretence of settling an account, and locked him in a room; a sedan chair was brought, and he was conveyed to the secret prison. His disappearance excited much talk and he was supposed to have fled, for the supposition of arrest by the Inquisition was scouted, seeing that there had not been sequestration, Cordero confessed at once that he was a Jew and, under torture, implicated his employer and two others. These were arrested on May 11th and the free employment of torture obtained the names of numerous accomplices. The prisons were full and to empty them an auto in the chapel was hurriedly arranged and preparations were made for the hasty construction of additional cells. On August llth, between 12:30 and 2 o'clock, seventeen arrests were made, so quietly and simultaneously that it was all effected before the people were conscious of it. These were among the most prominent citizens and greatest merchants of Lima, and we are told that the impression produced on the community was like the Day of Judgement. Torture and inquisitorial methods elicited further information resulting in additional arrests; the affrighted Portuguese began to scatter and, at the request of the tribunal, the Viceroy Chinchon prohibited for a year any one to leave Peru without its license. . . . One matter which vexed the souls of the inquisitors was the effort made by the threatened Portuguese to hide their property from sequestration. A proclamation was issued, ordering all who knew of such matters to reveal them within nine days under pain of excommunication and other penalties. This was successful to some extent, but the difficulties in the way were illustrated in the case of Enrique de Paz, for whom Melchor de los Reies secreted much silver, jewels and merchandise. Among other things he deposited with his friend Don Dionisio Manrique, Knight of Santiago, senior alcalde de corte and a consultor of the tribunal, a quantity of silver and some fifty or sixty pieces of rich silks. Manrique did not deny receiving them, but said that the same night Melchor ordered them taken away by a young man who was a stranger to him. The inquisitors evidently disbelieved the story; they reported that they had unsuccessfully tried friendly methods with Manrique and asked the Suprema for instructions. The sequestration of so much property brought all trade to a stand-still and produced indescribable confusion, aggravated, in 1635, by the consequent failure of the bank. The men arrested had nearly all the trade of the colony in their hands; they were involved in an infinity of complicated transactions and suits sprang up on all sides. Creditors and suitors pressed their claims desperately, fearing that with delay witnesses might disappear, in the widening circle of arrests. There were many suits pending already in the Audiencia which were claimed by the tribunal and surrendered to it. It was puzzled by the new business thus thrown upon it; to a suit there had to be two parties, but the prisoners could not plead, so it appointed Manuel de Monte Alegre as their "defensor" to appear for them, and it went on hearing and deciding complicated civil suits while conducting the prosecutions for heresy. Mondays and Thursdays were assigned for civil business, and every afternoon, from 3 P.m. until dark, was devoted to examination of the documents. The inquisitors claimed that they pushed forward strenuously in settling accounts and paying debts, for otherwise all commerce would be destroyed to the irreparable damage of the Republic, which was already exhausted in so many ways. This did not suit the Suprema, which, by letters of October 22d and November 9, 1635, forbade the surrender of any sequestrated or confiscated property, no matter what evidence was produced of ownership or claims, without first consulting it. This exacting payment of all debts and postponing payment of claims threatened general bankruptcy when the rich merchants were arrested, for their aggregate liabilities amounted to eight hundred thousand pesos ' which was estimated as equal to the whole capital of Lima. To avert this, some payments were made but only on the strength of competent security being furnished. . . . Meanwhile the trials of the accused were pushed forward as rapidly as the perplexities of the situation admitted. Torture was not spared. Murcia de Luna, a woman of 27, died under it. Antonio de Acuiia was subjected to it for three hours and when he was carried out, Alcaide Pradeda described his arms as being torn to pieces. Progress was impeded, however, by the devices of the prisoners, who were in hopes that influences at work in Spain would secure a general pardon like that of 1604. With this object they revoked their confessions and their accusations of each other, giving rise to endless complications. Some of the latter revocations, however, were genuine and were adhered to, even through the torture which was freely used in these cases. Besides this, to cast doubt on the whole affair, they accused the innocent and even Old Christians. . . . The inquisitors add that they abstained in many cases from making arrests, when the testimony was insufficient and the parties were not Portuguese. The tribunal was manned with four inquisitors, who struggled resolutely through this complicated mass of business, and at length were ready to make public the results of their labors in the auto of January 23, 1639. This was celebrated with unexampled pomp and ostentation, for now money was abundant and the opportunity of making an impression on the popular mind was not to be lost, During the previous night, when their sentences were made known to those who were to be relaxed, two of them, Enrique de Paz and Manuel de Espinosa, professed conversion; the inquisitors came and examined them, a consulta was assembled and they were admitted to reconciliation. There was great rivalry among men of position for the honor of accompanying the penitents and Don Salvadoro Veldzquez, one of the principal Indians, sargento mayor of the Indian militia, begged to be allowed to carry one of the effigies, which he did in resplendent uniform. Conspicuous in a place of honor in the procession were the seven who had been acquitted, richly dressed, mounted on white horses and carrying palms of victory, Besides the Judaizers there was a bigamist and five women penanced for sorcery. There was also the alcalde's assistant Valcdzar, who was deprived of his familiarship and was exiled for four years. Juan de Canelas Albarran, the occupant of a house adjoining the prison, who had permitted an opening through the walls for communications, received a hundred lashes and five years of exile, and Ana Maria González, who was concerned in the matter, had also a hundred lashes and four years of exile. Of the Judaizers there were seven who escaped with abjuration de vehementi, various penalties and fines aggregating eight hundred pesos. There were forty-four reconciled with punishments varied according to their deserts. Those who had confessed readily as to themselves and others were let off with confiscation and deportation to Spain. Those who prevaricated or gave trouble had, in addition, lashes or galleys or both. Of these there were twenty-one, the aggregate lashes amounting to four thousand and the years of galleys to a hundred and six, besides two condemnations for life. In addition to these were the mother of the Murcia de Luna who died under torture, Doha Mayor de Luna, a woman of high social position, and her daughter Doha Isabel de Luna, a girl of 18, who, for endeavoring to communicate with each other in prison, were sentenced to a hundred lashes through the streets, naked from the waist up. There was also one reconciliation in effigy of a culprit who had died in prison. There were eleven relaxations in person and the effigy of one who had committed suicide during trial. Of the eleven, seven are said to have died pertinacious and impenitent and therefore presumably were burnt alive, true martyrs to their belief. Of these there were two especially notable - Maldonado whose case has been mentioned above, and Manuel Bautista Pérez. The latter was the leader and chief among the Portuguese, who styled him the capitan grande. He was the greatest merchant in Lima and his fortune was popularly estimated at half a million pesos. It was in his house that were held the secret meetings in which he joined in the learned theological discussions, but outwardly he was a zealous Christian and had priests to educate his children; he was greatly esteemed by the clergy who dedicated to him their literary effusions in terms of the warmest adulation. He owned rich silver mines in Huarochiri and two extensive plantations; his confiscated house has since been known as the casas de Pilatos, and his ostentatious mode of life may be judged by the fact that when his carriage was sold by the tribunal it fetched thirty-four hundred pesos. He had endeavored to commit suicide by stabbing himself, but he never faltered at the end. He listened proudly to his sentence and died impenitent, telling the executioner to do his duty. There was one other prisoner who did not appear. Enrique Jorje Tavares, a youth of 18, was among those arrested in August, 1635. He denied under torture and after various alternations became permanently insane, for which reason his case was suspended in 1639. The next day the mob of Lima enjoyed the further sensation of the scourging through the streets. These exhibitions always attracted a large crowd, in which there were many horsemen who thus had a better view, while boys commonly pelted the bigamists and sorceresses who were the usual patients. On this occasion the tribunal issued a proclamation forbidding horses or carriages in the streets through which the procession passed, and any pelting of the penitents under pain, for Spaniards, of banishment to Chile, and for Indians and Negroes, of a hundred lashes. There were twenty-nine sufferers in all; they were marched in squads of ten, guarded by soldiers and familiars, while the executioners plied the scourges, and the brutalizing spectacle passed off without disturbance, and with the pious wish of the tribunal that it would please God to make it serve as a warning. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:29:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
as you can see... they were just crazy.. not fighting for christianity.. not for the bible.. just because they COULDN'T GET CRAZINESS OUT OF THEIR MIND.. hehehe sorry for caps |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:31:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
DENIAL...The worst blind is he who has eyes and yet refuses to see! Now thats TRASH! Good night! |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
whatever, I'm just tired.. I get agressive when I don't understand something when i'm tired.. just read my last two things.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:34:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
you can step in anytime you want mother.. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
My apologies stargazer.. i did not realize what you were talking about. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:38:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
well.. then.. looks like my job here is done *tips his hat* *rolls his safety patrol notebook in his hand and puts them in his holsters.. takes a last sip of water and walks out the door..* |
Date: 10/5/2001 10:40:00 PM
From Authorid: 7089
*chuckles, sits back, offers juniormints & popcorn to others in the gallery* you want that spritzer yet, fb? cheers,  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
Apology accepted , perhaps i should have said middle ages , instead of dark ages , but you must admmit , those were obviouslly DARK TIMES in history! |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:42:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
My job is also done...picks up his battle axe and drift into the night... |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:43:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
** applauds HUMA*** no son , your doing a great job. KEEP it up. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:48:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Wow TUGGER:: ya see that, my boy is one smart kid. Huma, have you ever noticed that those that fight the most must have the worst of the god of this worlds influence?? I mean gosh, how is they get *soooooooooooooo* upset?? If its just a little book, then why do they fight so hard for it?? Come on guys, are you like Jesus says, of your father the devil?? LOL, JUST kidding. Yes, tugger I think its about time for that and add a little pop corn. HUMA HUMA HUMA, you have done well my son. |
Date: 10/5/2001 10:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 277
"Jesus died because He was weak and stupid." Have you read the Harry Potter books, FirstBorn? Can you quote where it says anything negative about Jesus in the book? The author is clearly being sarcastic. May I also point out that "The Onion" (where you have gathered this information) is an online newspaper very similiar to the "national Enquirer" and "Weekly World News". We all know how credible most of the stories are in those magazines.  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 10:54:00 PM
From Authorid: 277
Huma, do you really think that anyone besides the author (with the exception of a very small few) would actually read your very long winded comment? Sorry, but I'm not about to read a comment five times longer (if not more) than the post itself. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:04:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Hawk that was an opinion of the little girl, it didnt say it was in the book. I knew all would come against this site, but ya know if I posted 25 sites I'm sure all would find a reason *that this site* was not seriouse but satire also. I guess any excuse to condone the occult and satanism is what ya'll look for. IF those dont want to read humas reply its simply because they perfer to believe what they will about the inquisition, and not the *facts* |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:07:00 PM
From Authorid: 277
Firstborn, Do you also realize that you are talking about what is right for children in the post. Yet The Onion (whose webpage you display) has a disclaimer on their home page which states "The Onion® is not intended for readers under 18 years of age." This is a G rated site. Check your FAQ'S>>>URL's in a post. A URL that points to a site that is not "G" rated or does not contain any information related to the post then the URL will be removed, the post might also be deleted and if it is not a "G" rated site your account may also be cancelled. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 23020
WHAT!?! This story is obviously fake! It bothers me just to hear about it! I have read all the books and found nothing like what the story said! Honestly do you really think a six year old kid said "jesus died because he was weak and stupid" not likely! Me being A wiccan for all of my life, you must know the darkside and the light, this does not mean that I practice Hate magick, It simply means that i know and have reaserched the dark side to better know the light. Even if its a satanist church it has to have rules to survive, they would never take a 10 year old kid just because he read a harry potter book. I think that if a book is so good that kids across the country turn of the tv and read its a good thing! Please take this into consideration before talking about another CHILDRENS book!!! |
Date: 10/5/2001 11:11:00 PM
From Authorid: 15033
Um, Huma? Why didn't you just make your own post, little buddy? Sorry guys, but I don't need crackers to know the "Onion" is Cheezy. I will say this however, I still think it's all in how you have been talking and explaining things to your kids that determines whether they will be taken by the idea that magic is real and sets them off looking for heavier stuff later. If you show them how believing in the things the Lord does is kind of magical through faith, and that is what the book can represent (positive thinking and faith)...I see no reason to fear that they will suddenly forget about Jesus...Love,  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:11:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Ok hawk I took the url off, as I didnt know that. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:11:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
The murder of hundreds of innocent people by the church is a fact! To deny it is not only wrong , but also obscene! Jews were killed because they refused to convert to the current religion of the time! And by the way it does not take a rocket scientist to copy and paste some article in this post! Ive travel to many different countries and had the good fortune to meet people from other cultures , let me tell you! Religious intolerance is the trade of the IGNORANT! Now how smart was that! |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:13:00 PM
From Authorid: 7089
fb: here's your popcorn & your spritzer, & tho your boy knows his stuff & all, all i'm gonna say to this post is indeed, if yours is such a little book too why do you fight so hard for it? ka-Ching...you know the rest. you put on some great shows tho-- maybe i should inquire abt season tickets? cheers, |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:17:00 PM
From Authorid: 19342
Count on me for a rematch , anytime! Funny the Talaban too , think they are doing GODS bidding! |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:18:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
You bet 23020, let turn off the educational channel and read about the occult, thats what I want my kids to do! *NOT*. Yes, six year olds are smart and they mock what they hear, I do believe that one would say and repeat what they hear. Ok, I've never read the Onion to begin with, this was just one of the sites it took me too while reading on this harry potter stuff. There are other sites, go find them. You can see for yourself. Hi, Thunderhead, my amen sister, thanks for that fact about the onion. however its not the only site against harry potter, believe me. StarGazer:: Jews were killed by hitler over 11 million of them after the count was finished. Yes, hitler said he was of God but ya know so do lots of people, but that DOES not mean that they have Jesus in their heart, and IT DOES not Mean they are talking about MY God, God the Father. Clearly the god hilter had was satan god of this world. YOU have made my point and shunned your own, YOUR religiouse INTOLEANCE is showing, stargazer, now how ignorant is that? Good night ya'll I have to go to bed now. Talk to you over coffee in the morning. |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:21:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Tugger, by all means, please, they dont cost a dime and you can come all year. Tickets are free. The difference between God and HIS word, is I never said," ITs just a book"" They have. Yep they sure are stargazer:: But the god of this world and not God the FAthers bidding. YOU need to learn to know the difference. ONCE again, good night/ |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:25:00 PM
From Authorid: 15033
nighty Night, my AMEN SISTER!! Love ya, |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:27:00 PM
From Authorid: 277
There have been many books banned over the years. Frankenstein was banned in South Africa and so was Black Beauty in the 50's I think. Then of course Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn. In 89, Little Red Riding Hood was banned because the book said she brought food and "wine" to Grandmothers house! They didn't want to promote alcohol. The bible hasn't been banned in schools yet, but cases where state schools had to stop special treatment favoring the religious messages of the Bible. They already got rid of prayers in schools. Keep pushing Harry Potter as evil and I guarantee that officials will ban everything that a few people find offensive. Pretty soon we'll have nothing because of censorship. |
Date: 10/5/2001 11:37:00 PM
From Authorid: 30743
My reply on another such post I saw tonight... What I find amazing is the absolute defense these books are recieving. Do you know, I think more people come out to defend this book than they do the Bible? I just find it ironic, really. Considering that these books are fiction, not based at all in reality, yet people still defend them as if Harry Potter were real. It is just a book. You read it, you don't. Unless you want to go back on your sworn word that it is fiction and nothing else and say... What? The only book that I would stand and defend, lose my life for, be tortured for, is the Bible. So tell me, why the heated defense for a work of fiction? Why the contreversy if these books are to you just a pleasing read? I haven't read the books, nor will I. I simply desire to know why so many people defend it as if Harry Potter were really alive and breathing today. Hmmmm...  |
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Date: 10/5/2001 11:44:00 PM
From Authorid: 277
Yes, why the heated defense for a work of fiction? It is just a book. That's what we're trying to tell you people. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:16:00 AM
From Authorid: 19342
My religious intolerance? What are you kidding me? Whos waving the "I KNOW WHAT GOD THINKS" flag here? Certainly not me! To quote OZZY OSBORNES song..."I spoke to God this morning and he doesnt like you" Who am i to say what is right or wrong in the eyes of GOD? You know what? this is getting old...i think ive made my point! so...good night! |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:22:00 AM
From Authorid: 19342
If not the book , the rock music is from Satan or who knows Pokemon ,matchbox cars,cheerios,bubble gum! Are we allowed to pass gas? Such an offensive smell , maybe is from the devil too? copied from the other post. |
Date: 10/6/2001 12:23:00 AM
From Authorid: 31368
This came from the ONION? Do you know I just read an article on there last week saying that Rosie O'donnel, and another actress can't remember who, were dead. It also went on to QUOTE several political figures as saying they were glad they were dead, because they promoted lazy fat, housewives to sit on their a** and get fatter. It also went on to say that the network was going to find another lazy fata** to take her place, so not to worry, the lazy fat housewives would still have someone to look up to. I have seen JK Rowlings on many talk shows, and she would not say anything like this. We have also seen wiccans on this site, say that if children are considering becoming a wiccan to be able to do the spells Harry does, they will be disappointed because this book is not what wicca is about. It's posts like this coming from unreputable sources, that start hoaxes and cause uproars. We have all been witness to how easily rumors are spread over the internet, and I think we are all aware that any smartalek 13 year old kid, could post something on the web and say it was from a reputable newspaper. I think if we want to know that information we are recieving is real we should be sure we are reading it from a newspaper with our own eyes. Let's not add to the rumors and hoaxes. ***Shelly***  |
Date: 10/6/2001 12:25:00 AM
From Authorid: 31275
hmm...lol!!! are u absolutely sure Rowling said that about her own book? I find it highly doubtful she would say that...It seems obvious to me that someone who has never read a Harry Potter book made up these quotes. People have to remember that this is a fictional book and it does not teach you how to do magic. "And, of course, practically all of them are virgins, which is gravy." ???? LOL!! yeah...okay....Whoever came up with these quotes have been watching too many movies. Oh, wait a minute you got these quotes from 'The Onion'?! lol. Okay that explains it....! PAI  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:53:00 AM
From Authorid: 21867
Yo FB, I like the quotes you picked out that 'show' how sinister Harry Potter books are by what the young kids etc are saying about them. Can I throw in a few quotes of my own...okay, heres one: "I/We do this in the name of God"...said by SOOOOO many religious fanatics just before they slaughter people, commit mass suicide, bomb shopping malls, kill abortionists, start 'Holy Wars', oppress people or even hi-jack planes. Okay - I agree...thats a little harsh. But my point is that anyone can pull out a quote from someone that shines a bad light on whatever they are attacking. My views on Harry Porter are this: I don't have a problem with them, because I have learnt about both sides...the Good forces and the Bad forces. What I do find disagreeable about them is that they are targetted at children...and I really feel that children shouldn't be exposed to only one side of 'magic'. I actually read a few Harry Potter books to see what all the hullabaloo was...and I actually kinda agree with you. In that I was exposed to these things as I was growing up...but it was a balanced exposure...I was taught the good and the bad. Almost like the 'morals of magic'...if there is such a thing. A number of the uses of 'magic' mentioned in the Harry Potter books I read I would place firmly in the 'bad-use' category...so I do believe that IF children are to read these books then they need to be exposed to the FULL story...not a sugar-coated glossed up view of what is potentially VERY dangerous for them to engage in. Peace,  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 1:06:00 AM
From Authorid: 21867
...I see the reply from my honey, Thunderhead, I gotta agree with that. What really gets me is that pure 'magic' doesn't come from yourself...but from God. There are many healing acts that have been carried out. Many miracles that have been performed...some may call them magic...but I believe that person channeled the power of the Lord through them. The Tohungas (spiritual leaders/healers/experts) of my people have always told me that any power they have is NOT theirs...it is Gods...they merely open themselves up to God, to be the hands of God and perform healings that way. One of the things I really didn't like about H.Potter books was this notion that magic was a power that the user could acquire...that THEY were the magical force...that the magic they performed came from them. Nope...don't like that at all. For I have been taught that there IS a force what will allow you to hold it for a while...that will trick you into a false belief that the power you have IS yours...and that force is EVIL. So my worry is that kids might go down the road of magic...looking to acquire it...trying to become powerful in the arts of magic, and through that misconception they open themselves up to evil. Peace, |
Date: 10/6/2001 2:41:00 AM
From Authorid: 30229
Okay, Okay, I will let my ignorance show here, but I have a couple pennies here... Can that buy MY two cents worth??? lol... I do NOT condone anything of a satanic subject matter... In fact, I have weird feelings when around something that honors Satanic practices, including magic and spell castings... HERE is my ignorance, I have NEVER read the Potter books, and after seeing all this, you can bet your sweet bippy that I never will!!! Like Monkeyluvr, there is ONLY ONE BOOK that I would defend with my life and that is God's own words, the Bible!!! And to shorten my reply, I will have to also say, BRAVO!!! to Agent Smith, because he summed it up really well!! I would never tolerate my child being taught anything to do with Satanic teachings, spell casting, magic, evil spirits, or anything along those lines... I would take them out of school and home school first... I do NOT want anything to do with the practices of Satan... and that is MY opinion, Thanks for allowing me to say it, even though it is a little off the subject of the Potter books... :)  |
Date: 10/6/2001 6:04:00 AM
From Authorid: 15998
I don't want to sound heartless or anything, Personally, I don't see how this can be such a controversy. Jeeze, it's a book! lol. Aren't you supposed to let your imagination run wild with books? For gosh's sake I read a book about a toilet that was like attacking this kid (gooflumps... don't ask, lol) and they had to get a new toilet.... but that doesn't mean my toilet is going to attack me and that I have to get a new one, lol. that would just be silly. I believe it depends on the mentality of the people who read it as to how it would affect them. If they believe anything they hear, they maybe they shouldn't. But c'mon, this is a chance for people to 'learn' about something other than their own religion. Maybe the reason they are drawn to whatever is in the books is because they were forced to believe something they didn't even understand and this they do... jmo  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 6:25:00 AM
From Authorid: 15998
sorry... *maybe they shouldn't read the book. (I don't want anyone to take what i said there the wrong way) :) |
Date: 10/6/2001 6:56:00 AM
From Authorid: 18201
WHAT AN UTTER CROCK! What were your sources?! I've heard some pretty stupid things about the Harry Potter books, a good 98% of which were untrue, but this takes the cake! Some people will stop at nothing, including lies and forgery, to gain followers to their cause and this is just another attempt at that! I have read the Harry Potter books and find them to be well written, yes, but about as "spiritually accurate" as the lable on a can of nuts! IT'S FICTION! Why can't anyone understand that?! The real victim here is Ms. Rowling! She has released a series of well written books and has enjoyed the success that most writers only dream of...not because she's signed some contract with the devil, but because she is a talented writer! If parents don't want their child reading the books, don't let them! It's that simple! We read them to see whether we wanted our son to see the movie or not. We decided that it was fine, since my son has enough of a clue as to what is real and what is fiction to not believe what he saw on the screen. There is nothing accurate about the spells, books or practices in the books... Do you honestly still believe that Witches fly around on brooms?! DO you really think that we have some school hidden somewhere in the mists?! I know that some people would like to see us burned at the stake again, but did you ever stop to think that it is because people act like this that you are driving others away from your cause, and not drawing them in?! You don't see pagans massing in the streets or at the bookstores to picket the sales of new releases! You don't see pagans gathering at the schools to have the children of christians expelled, do you? We don't go door to door trying to convert people to our cause and then threaten them when they decline, and continue to return week after week, and send countless piles of literature to their home...We don't rewrite our holy books (not that we have holy books) to include wrongs never committed by others, just so we can persecute them...we have never sent warriors out into the midst of other religious capitols to murder innocents that do not fall to our cause...Pagans are content to simply be! We are happy to have what we do, and the blessings that we have...we don't need to dominate the globe! Is it so wrong that we believe in racial and cultural equality?! Is it wrong that we teach "to each his own" and "Harm None"?! Is it wrong that we learn how to heal people with herbs instead of harmful drugs?! I'd have to agree with Stargazer...look at the Inquisition! Look at the Crusades! Look at what was done to the Knights Templar! Look at the Witch Trials! Millions upon Millions of people murdered in the name of the Christian God...based on the words of one book that has been changed millions of times over the centuries! Not even Christians can agree on teh correctness of the Bible! If they could, there wouldn't be so many versions! Even in the Bible the followers of God display magical powers in God's name! God is God! It does not matter what you call him/her...What matters is that you are a good person and that you do not commit sins against others. A sin is nothing more than something that is morally wrong...it's not just something that goes against the Christian God. This country was founded on the basis of Religious Freedom! Why is it that so many people continue to attack those of other religions simply because they don't agree?! Why are so many innocent Muslims being driven out of the country? Do you honestly believe that they are all in league with the terrorists?! It is all the same thing! Just because you don't happen to agree with what is written in the Harry Potter series doesn't mean that the author is trying to convert people or bash some other religion...it doesn't mean that she intends to convert children to the Pagan path. I have met many other pagans that don't want their ids reading the books because of the "inaccurate depiction" of witches! Others allow their kids to read the books because they're simply good reading! They are very well written...which is what anyone looks for in a book! In any case, you really should do a litle more research for your posts and don't just pull things from sites that can't back up their stuff either. I have spent the last several months pulling articles like this for my site; uncovering the improper quotes, pointing out misinformation and adding my editorial comments...your post is just another attempt to make more out of something than there really is and attack innocent people that do not deserve it.  |
Date: 10/6/2001 7:31:00 AM
From Authorid: 19220
Oh my not again. Just going to sit back. The Onion?!?! hehehehe....  |
Date: 10/6/2001 9:21:00 AM
From Authorid: 6528
Ahhhh that's scary...I read them..like them...I'm a good little Lutheran girl!!  |
Date: 10/6/2001 9:23:00 AM
From Authorid: 11091
These are just a series of kids books, fiction and just are just books. I love the Harry Potter series and encourage children to read them. I am glad they are being read to children at home and at school. They teach that everyone can succeed, to be your own person, that you can overcome hardships and right and wrong.  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:02:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thunderhead:::: good morning my amen sister. Hawk:: When they took prayer out of the schools, I found that pretty offensive. When they took the ten commandments off the wall I found that pretty offensive. I'm just about tired of the censorship brought on by the non-believers, so I guess its not a bad thing to give them a little taste of their own medicine. MONKEYLUVR:: I also will defend the word of God and according to the word of God, books such as these that teach young children HOW to practice the occult, and give them the desire to find out more about HOW to cast spells ect, should not be read by children and certainly not by christian children. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:07:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
stargazer:: you spout that I have intolerance, how does the shoe fit now??? HEY SHELLY:: LOl, I told you, and others, I had never gone to that site before, I knew nothing about it other than it came up on one of my seachers, however OTHER sites say the same thing. Pai:: I saw rowling on t.v. I certainly wasnt impressed by the things she implied. AGent Smith:: YOU are so right, they are targeted at children and I dont think that children should be subject to only one side. MY children are and have been told about both sides, and I also firmly placed the other side in the "bad-use" category. Yes, they need to be exposed to the full story, but see not all parents even are aware of the full story, only care about half of the story, and some are totally ignorant about the spirit realm. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:13:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
AGentSmith:: All the power is from God that the people of God use. Just as power that comes from the darkside, comes from a differnt god, the god of this world, the one God the Father tells us not to have anything to do with. I'm with you, anyone, dark majic or the powers of God, do not come FROM SELF. YES ITS EVIL, i agree with you here 100% because the children that are trying to channel this power and think they can control it, cant control it, it will soon control them. YOU have just said it better than I could ever have said it myself. But see agent smith, so many people do not even EVEN believe that such power is real and this is where the problem lays. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:20:00 AM
From Authorid: 277
"so I guess its not a bad thing to give them a little taste of their own medicine" SO is trying to ban a book just a revenge thing because you think it's evil? You haven't even read the book. Read the book, then tell me what you think about it. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:26:00 AM
From Authorid: 277
..."I spoke to God this morning and he doesnt like you" LMAO@Stargazer!!! |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:26:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
GAil:: no actually what you have to say is not off the subject, it is the subject. thanks for stopping by. Scooter:: learning something and having an imagination is a far cry from allowing the spirits of darkness control of you. MOONSHADOW:: YOU just said, its was *spiritually accurate** YET you say its fiction?? YOu cant have it both ways. If its spiritually accurate then KIDS will attempt to learn how to do these things themselves. GOD the Father is not in this, he warns us against doing this type of thing as these forces that go to work for the kids will eventaully take them over, the children wont have the control, the dark spirits will as they are opening them selves up to something they know nothing about. NO< I dont believe that witches fly around on brooms but I've dealt with enough that have tried to come against the children that we took in that had come out of satanism to know that they can, change shapes, they can send their spirits to other places, and that their majic can and does work, the only thing is that IS is defenseless against the POWER and the name of JEsus. For in the name of Jesus I have seen them sent back to where they come from and the negative forces that they have sent have been sent three fold against them. NO, all witches do not practice dark or black majic, but some do. Plenty do. NO< I DONT see all that happening with the schools and door to door stuff, but then God does say that those things that are done in secret will be brought into light. Now, if you want to go on about Christians and our roots that have nothing to do with us today, then what about your own, part which is based on christianty, part that is base on black majic of the witches and satanist in the past, the ones that did children and virgin sacrafices, killed INNOCENT babies just so that they could have more POWER. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:26:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
NOW once again MOONSHADOW::: yoU Claim to be wiccan, the modern Wiccan concept of the Horned God has its literary origin in a Paganized re-interpretation of medieval Christian Devil imagery (as in Margaret Murray's and earlier writings). It's true that medieval Christian Devil imagery, in turn, incorporates distorted versions of many ancient Gods (not all of whom were Horned, e.g. the trident comes from Poseidon/Neptune). But the Wiccan image of its Horned God is not a direct continuation of any ancient religion, and at least one key aspect does come from no source other than the medieval Christian Devil concept as manifest in the witchhunts. The idea of a Horned God associated specifically with witchcraft is derived from the Christian witchhunts, and from no previous source. In pre-Christian European religion, there were Goddesses associated with witchcraft, e.g. Hecate; but Pan and other horned male Gods were not associated with witchcraft, as far as I know. Much of Wicca's self-image is based on the Paganized re-interpretation of alleged Devil-worship, rather than on actual ancient religion. Much of Wicca's terminology and imagery, e.g. the words "witch", "coven", and "sabbat", are used because of the Wiccan myth that Wicca is the survival of an underground medieval religion that was the target of the witchhunts. (Regardless of the linguistic origin of the words themselves, this constellation of terms comes from the witchhunts.) The related idea that modern Wiccans too are in continual danger of being confused with Satanists is at least partly a self-fulfilling prophecy. Far fewer people would confuse modern Wicca with Satanism if Wicca didn't use so many witchhunt-derived words and other trappings popularly associated with diabolical witchcraft. |
Date: 10/6/2001 10:41:00 AM
From Authorid: 17825
well firstborn im back LOL and this thing just gives me chills now.IF the "onion" or whatever is fake they are really sick o use an example like that and say a child said it regardless if its true or not but still the fact remains SOMEONE had these opinions either adult or children and posted them to make people listen and to me that is just sick and freaky,someone is messed up in the head and i have been putting off researching this harry potter character but now i feel i must i mean the wizard of oz was an imagination story and i love it but this harry potter has caused so much contraversary CAN he be that good for people??? im gonna find out and firstborn ty for posting and anything that isnt for God is against him and if it speaks out against God then i will wholeheartedly agree with firstborn even though for the most part i already agree with her as she knows her stuff (((((((((hugs all)))))))))000  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:51:00 AM
From Authorid: 19220
Totally off subject here....I have read that the Horned God pre-dates the witch hunts. I will get the author and name for you and message you only if you wish. Just for the record, I hope I didn't misunderstand your response about the Horned god. If so, I aploigize. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 11:15:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thanks kimmygirl; and check it out really good. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 11:18:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
ICeQueen: thanks. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 11:18:00 AM
From Authorid: 15033
I found a site for WICCANS...has some interesting info on it...http://folksites.com/Insite/ |
Date: 10/6/2001 11:47:00 AM
From Authorid: 3648
I don't know.... I let my kids read Harry Potter....they know the books are FICTION heck why not ban Stephen King next?? Or even ban every movie that shows a superhero flying? since that must be the work of the devil too? Why not ban blowing candles out on birthday cakes since that is a pagan practice...since they do spells with candles? Lets ban a child ever having an imagination and let them turn into lifeless zombies who only do as they are told....never using the brain they are given.....just because there are beliefs out there we don't or can't understand does not make them evil and of the devil....I mean cmon..... |
Date: 10/6/2001 12:00:00 PM
From Authorid: 18103
I am a Christian. And have to say GeG sis, "you go girl". Kids are not supposed to be kids? They are not to have fun? What is this world coming to? I do not agree with someone thinking everything now days is bad for our children.  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:42:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
WEll AFTER reading so many replies on this post, it seems to me that what God has to say is more true than ever. That those with a carnal mind CANNOT discern the things of the spirit. greyeyed girl, lots of books are fiction, they say anton leveys satanic bible is fiction, so let your kid read that one too. Graywolf, I just dont know what to tell ya. Everything is NOT bad for our children, but when it goes against their spiritual nature, yes, its bad for them. ITs Christians, or people that call them selves christians that apparently Dont know what the word of God has to tell us, and about spiritual discernment, that make it bad for the rest of Gods children. But I guess its better to take the side of the world that the side of God huh?? |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:43:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
Have you not heard? children are our future, our future i to be attacked first, they don't want to attack a bunch of hormone driven 18 year olds.. but rather build up pressure upon our children.. these adults know of life.. they know between good and evil, they have chosen if they want to be good or evil, now children have not chosen.. they can only listen to what they hear... |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:45:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
*groans* here we go again, I never should've left so soon, now i gotta catch up on the debate.. don't mind me.. *grabs a bowl of tortia chips and salsa.. ohh and maybe some popcorn.. with lots of butter.. salt... and LARD! |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:48:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
The Dark Lord placed the scar of the moon upon harry's forehead.. for the past months, the unsuspecting children have put tattos of the scars of the half moon upon their foreheads.. and therefore are taking the agony of harry.. the agony of the dark lord.. err.. whats his name? oh that doesnt matter.. notice the simularitys between Norse God Odin, and the Dark Lord of Harry Potter.. they both ride 6 legged horses.. they both have steel bladed swords and purple lances.. but Odin is green skined and has antlers.. wait.. the dark lord has horns! therefore representing antlers.. well you can let your kids read harry potter if you are a norseman.. and you whole family is devout to the norse gods.. but how many people have you seen attend a norse church service? *cricks churp* |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
the crusades... the inquistion... none of it is in the name of my lord.. they all did what they did so that they could crave the insanity within their minds.. read my extremely long reply.. or do i need to rephrase that and type it again in a diffrent FORMAT? |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
now it takes long enough to load the overall page.. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 12:57:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
They were crazy... hehehe... all crazy... hehehe. whats that? I'm crazy.. no im not!! leave me alone!!! ahhhh |
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Date: 10/6/2001 1:03:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
huma nice to see you on now. AS my grandkids are soon to arrive and I wont be able to stay on here too much longer, only a little here and a little there. I thank you for all your comments, my son, love mom. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 1:12:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
I sat here for 30 minutes typing a big long speech about the crusades.. then it says.. SORRY NO PROFANE COMMENTS... but I will summerize it.. it was much more complicating than you think.. it was basically misunderstandment of "his people" they were to befriend and finanacially trade.. not slaughter.. plus it is martial law.. not christianic law.. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 1:13:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
see my bibliography.. from fordham university.. here is the medieval sourcebook on the crusades http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/sbook1k.html |
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Date: 10/6/2001 6:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 21867
Yo FB, Oh my goodness...I think we agreed on something there *shock horror*. As I say...what I don't like about H.Potter is that these books create a desire within children to seek out magic, but don't really provide the true balance of the risks AND responsibilities that come with magic. Nor do they really speak about WHAT 'magic' is. And I agree that most people don't believe in magic and think that magic is just a load of rubbish...I believe otherwise as I have encountered it. And thats another one of the dangers...the disbelief. As long as the majority deny the existance of these things, the greater these things grow...the more freedom they have to move around unchallenged. Evil loves the shadows...and ignorance provides the largest shadow possible. Peace, |
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Date: 10/6/2001 6:17:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
AND a BIG AMEN to that Agent Smith. WE may not agree on some issues but on this one I'm with you 1,000% and thanks I'm glad someone does really understand. Thank You. |
Date: 10/6/2001 7:03:00 PM
From Authorid: 17516
Deb, I replied to this same post by Puff months ago. I researched it and there WAS no 17 July interview of JK Rowlings by the London Times. The articles you keep finding are rubbish. Do the research yourself (it's very easy to find the London Times site online) and please tell us what you find.  |
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Date: 10/6/2001 7:39:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
*in a childish voice* oohhhh.. busted... ohhhh! busted :) I agree with Agent Smith.. and to mom.. ohhh.. busted.. ohhh :) |
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Date: 10/6/2001 7:46:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
I have also heard information about this london times "hoax" though I have no interest to research it |
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Date: 10/6/2001 7:48:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
*picks up his katana scabbard ready to thrust his katana back within the frosty shell.. if Everyone is done.. I shall leave this debate.. anyone up to some more?* |
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Date: 10/6/2001 7:57:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Hi, Karma, rather or not rowling said that the facts of the books themself still remain. YOU cant dispute that. The fact is that they DO TEACH about witchcraft, they Do encourage children to try majic and they do speak of things that go against God. |
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Date: 10/6/2001 9:59:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
not directly though it does mom, (amen) i didn't realize this till yesterday, but its not really THAT wiccan, its mainly all NORSE |
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Date: 10/6/2001 10:01:00 PM
From Authorid: 16989
and I'm sure you wiccans don't support the norse odin either.. now we have come to an argreement! christians and wiccans! woo hoo |
Date: 10/6/2001 10:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 6860
OMG! THESE HARRY POTTER DEBATES ARE GETTING OLD! ITS A FREAKIN BOOK! A CHILDS BOOK! A FICTIONAL BOOK! AND MAYBE THESE CHILDRENS "THOUGHTS" WERE IMPOSED BY THEIR PARENTS NOT THE BOOKS! AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED, I KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN REALITY AND UNREALITY AND IF THE CHILDREN DONT KNOW IT, ITS THE PARENTS FAULT. IF YOU DONT LIKE THE BOOKS, DONT LET YOUR CHILDRENS READ THEM AND THEN LOCK YOURSELF IN THE CLOSET BECAUSE THESE BOOKS ARE POPULAR AND YOU'RE GONNA HEAR ABOUT THEM. I THINK YOU NEED TO CONCERN YOURSELF WITH MORE PRESSING ISSUES INSTEAD OF A CHILDRENS BOOK THAT WILL NOT GET BANNED FROM MY HOUSE OR A MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE IN THE WORLD. Night,  |
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Date: 10/7/2001 6:15:00 AM
From Authorid: 18201
FirstBorn...you sem to have it backwards. The Horned God and belief in him (I am not Wiccan BTW...Pagan yes, Wiccan NO...and they are NOT the same) predates the Christian characterization of the devil, which was brought about during the Inquisition, by hundreds of years. Originally, the Inquisition was set about to uphold the laws of the Church (and thereby the King). The first knights were sent out to attack Jeruselem after a Christian Temple there was burned. The king of that area had been over thrown, the temple rebuilt, and yet still the Chruch came in with 10000 men and murdered thoushands of innocents. The "rules" of the inquisition did not state that those of other religions should be persecutes...in fact, it allowed for those of other religions to live peacefully...but when the CHrurch realized that their efforts to convert the local Pagan population were not working to their satisfaction, they adopted the likeness of the Horned God, superimposed it upon the Christian idea of the Devil, and decreed that the Pagan people were actually worshipping Satan, and not a nature deity. (This is historical fact). Satanism is VERY different from WitchCraft...and can even be traced back the the Catholic Church itself, who in a small way WROTE the satanic Bible for Anton LaVey! No one in teh church ever witnessed a Rite, nor had they attended any ceremonies, or seen any actual worship, but still they wrote lengthy and elaborate books on the rituals of the Satanic Mass (which is a reversal of a Catholic Mass) and were the first to state that Satanists participate in "all things unholy". The only ones that identify Witches to Satanists are Christians. This is because of the Christian representation of the devil. There has also been documented proof that parts of the bible were removed because they were too much like the beliefs of the Pagans; belief in reincarnation, herbal healing, astrological references, etc. Christian beliefs can be traced back to their roots in Zoroasterism, which was the FIRST religion to believe in Heaven, Hell and A singular Godhead. I can provide you with an extensive booklist and reference guide, if you like. |
Date: 10/7/2001 7:55:00 AM
From Authorid: 23866
Oh come ON, Firstborn! I have SEEN the interview where J.K. Rowling was asked about her books leading kids to the occult. She did NOT say that. And if she had, don't you honestly think it would be plastered all over the media? Also, those "quotes" don't prove a thing beyond "someone with a keyboard can type"  |
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Date: 10/7/2001 8:02:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Runningwolf::: WE are to believe what your saying, when you dont even know the difference between CAPS and NON_CAPS???? MOONSHADOW:: I COPY AND pasted that right from a wiccan site, in which a memeber from usm has up and running, if you have a problem with it speak to her, not me. A. Lady, REad reply to Karma, my view still stands. |
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Date: 10/7/2001 8:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 16989
Ah Ha, moon shadow, you yourself backed me up in your reply, as I said the spanish Inquistion, and the Crusades were by martial law, and set up by the armadan, as well as the political points of the nations, NOT the church itself, the way you gbacked me up, as that you said the KING had started the Inquistion.. Horned God? That is NOT the christianic view of Satan, how uneducated was that? a true christian knows that satan is a beautiful man, handsom.. yet cute to the teenagers if you know what i mean, that is his appearence,.. anyone who sees him will fall madly in love.. I am not Catholic, Nor do catholics have the same viewpoints as me and Firstborn about these events.. the inquistion, and the crusades... (I wonder how many bad ratings this story got?) |
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Date: 10/7/2001 8:37:00 AM
From Authorid: 16989
I still say the horned God, is Odin, himself.. Lancer of Norse enemies.. diplomat of the Catholics.. ect |
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Date: 10/7/2001 8:46:00 AM
From Authorid: 16989
http://www.christianet.com/free/clipart/misc/misc_20.gif http://www.christianet.com/free/clipart/misc/misc_19.gif http://media.bigstep.com/shop/1/56/7304561/upload/968817527782.jpg these pictures, are the christian image of Satan, they are mearly.. pictures of Beautiful angels.. |
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Date: 10/7/2001 9:23:00 AM
From Authorid: 16989
hmm that was quite fun, perhaps i'll join you in debating more often mom, thanks for the wild adventure, |
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Date: 10/7/2001 10:08:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Your welcome huma, and I have to go do some stuff today, so be sure and keep check on this post son, love mom |
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Date: 10/7/2001 10:55:00 AM
From Authorid: 42539
if you want to sit back with your eyes and ears closed go for it!i am pagan not wiccan and i have no problems with my kids reading a bible but when they read harry potter i make sure to till them that the books are not real . but if we are on a book ban lets ban all the books that talk of killing , hate . or powers that most poeple don't have . as far as moons on forheads i wear a moon every full moon and have since i was 6 months old. harry potter didn't teach that to me.as far as horned gods go as i said i am pagan not wiccan and we have had horned gods for thousands of years . with that said i'm going back to bed now .....morningfire |
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Date: 10/7/2001 11:25:00 AM
From Authorid: 42539
if you want to sit back with your eyes and ears closed go for it!i am pagan not wiccan and i have no problems with my kids reading a bible but when they read harry potter i make sure to till them that the books are not real . but if we are on a book ban lets ban all the books that talk of killing , hate . or powers that most poeple don't have . as far as moons on forheads i wear a moon every full moon and have since i was 6 months old. harry potter didn't teach that to me.as far as horned gods go as i said i am pagan not wiccan and we have had horned gods for thousands of years . with that said i'm going back to bed now .....morningfire |
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Date: 10/7/2001 11:26:00 AM
From Authorid: 42539
sorry don't know why it went 2 times |
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Date: 10/7/2001 11:30:00 AM
From Authorid: 23866
(Sorry, Firstborn, I couldn't find your response to Karma) Now, you talk about giving children knowledge of "both sides" and how the Potter books don't do that, but you're doing the exact same thing: It's the Christian way or the highway. And regardless of personal views on Harry Potter, what I'm trying to point out is that this entire post is NOT TRUE. MISREPRESENTATION. NOT FACT. She did not say those things, and I highly suspect any of those "kids" did either. |
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Date: 10/7/2001 1:00:00 PM
From Authorid: 42539
ok i just went to the site where you got this info this is the same site that says "God Diagnosed With Bipolar Disorder" ok whats wrong with this the way you are talking if it was writing on here then even this must be true....morningfire |
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Date: 10/7/2001 1:19:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Date: 10/6/2001 7:57:00 PM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 16671 Hi, Karma, rather or not rowling said that the facts of the books themself still remain. YOU cant dispute that. The fact is that they DO TEACH about witchcraft, they Do encourage children to try majic and they do speak of things that go against God. AS FOR THE REST OF IT i ALREADY SAID, THAT I DIDNT KNOW ABOUT THE ONION, BUT THE REST OF IT STANDS, GO SEE MY NEW POST AS IT HAS MORE INFORMAITION FOR YOU UNBELIEVERS. I WILL NOT RESPOND TO THIS POST NOW THAT THE NEW ONE IS UP. THANK YOU. |
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Date: 10/7/2001 3:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 6860
What does caps have to do with my response and opinion? |
Date: 10/7/2001 3:46:00 PM
From Authorid: 44321
Listen i have read everyone of those books and i see nothing wrong with them ..want to know why because they are FICTION,and if parents are reading them to their kids they know how to teach them what is right and wrong. Parents all over the country have the right to make the decision on whether or not their kids will read these books.I for one would never let fanatical people make up my mind for me! it's people like the fanatics who lead book bannings.  |
Date: 10/8/2001 11:01:00 AM
From Authorid: 27678
The reality is that these books are just a way of disguising a "religious belief" and promoting it as well. Sounds appropriate as any religion that promotes the hatred of GOD is going to be hiding in the shadows, not in the LIGHT! By the way, not all CHRISTIANS, who believe in the BIBLE, are CATHOLICS, and many Protestants were heretics and were killed by the Catholics as well. So get your facts straight regarding the INQUISITION and the holidays as well, are Pagan and Catholic in origin, and in my opinion, anyone who is truly interested in following the BIBLE, will denounced such garbage. Free Girl  |
Date: 11/9/2001 6:08:00 PM
From Authorid: 17259
a 10 yr old in a satanic church lol where'd you get this FB national enquirer.com lol  |
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Date: 11/9/2001 9:53:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
running wolf, No one likes caps, its hard on the eyes and your response and opinion may not be read if you continue to use them. Occult kid:: You just dont know what your into. |
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Date: 11/9/2001 9:53:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
running wolf, No one likes caps, its hard on the eyes and your response and opinion may not be read if you continue to use them. Occult kid:: You just dont know what your into. |
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