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Date: 8/18/2000 12:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 10915
Very Interesting...Girlie  |
Date: 8/18/2000 12:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 4739
Wow! Now can you explain that all to me in English!  I think you put my brain on overload on this one, Rangerider! You shouldn't spring these stories on people towards the end of the day! Just kidding! I really enjoyed reading this. I've never heard this before; it's remarkable! It sure does give you a lot to think about.  |
Date: 8/18/2000 12:32:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
tammy did you ever find that book willmingtons guide to the bible? it is full of info like this.  |
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Date: 8/18/2000 1:02:00 PM
From Authorid: 11240
You're very well read, Rangerider, and I for one thank you for your information. When God banished certain angels from Heaven, did He fling them into space and to all these planets, including earth? Did these intelligent beings then interact with the evolution that God was enacting to produce some of the great marvels of construction on this earth? Do the descendants of these angels flung from Heaven onto other planets come to earth (UFO's) in order to discover the "secret" of living in God's Grace? God Bless. Deb  |
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Date: 8/18/2000 1:30:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
DEb don't doubt but some of what you say is true.but the angels that turned against God are either chained in the pit awaiting judgement or causing problems for mankind by disrupting Gods plans for man. the are still at war with God. God has his angels Satan has his. their is a book that may now be hard to come by that has many of these answers call The Omega conspiracy; really floored me when I read it. by an english Baptist pastor by the name of IDE Thomas. there is also Chuck missler who has done much research on this. he is on the internet and has what is called the missler report. sould come up if you type it in to search on the internet. here is another excellent site for this type of info. http://www.ldolphin.org/ |
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Date: 8/18/2000 2:04:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
another site "and I do not agree w/ every thing on the site" is this. >>>>>>>>> http://www.geocities.com/Area51/3403/ |
Date: 8/18/2000 2:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 11211
I knew about the last one Mormonism, but had no ideal about all the rest of this story. I am amazed! I am trying to grasp everything I read these days, and this is great! Glad you posted this. Whitedove.  |
Date: 8/19/2000 3:25:00 AM
From Authorid: 160
RR, Excellent research and although I have some knowledge of Nimrod and his history, you filled in a lot of blanks for me. I am curious to know if you found any refrence to the trinity in Babel? Also, we are aware that Nimrod was a mighty hunter in opposition to Jehovah so anything that he produced in the way of worship of course would be considered false. Any mention of the goddess Saturnalia? I believe this to be an ancient celebration of this Goddess done by way of festivals every year on or around December 17, coinsiding with the winter solstice. I believe this has it's roots in ancient Babel as well and so would be another false teaching carried on. Wouldn't Christmas is the modern day corrolation of this celebration?  |
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Date: 8/19/2000 8:05:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
sure pammyjo it is found in gen:11-7 7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech. 8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city. |
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Date: 8/19/2000 8:06:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
iwill answer the rest in a day or two, when i return. |
Date: 8/19/2000 6:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 177
I believe that the story of the Tower of Babel, the Deluge, the Garden of Eden, are legends that were shared & incorporated by many of the mid-eastern cultures of ancient times. When the Jews were held captive by the Babylonians, they adapted many of the myths that the Sumerian peoples believed in. It is being discovered by modern science that there was a particularly large flood in the area of what is now known as the Black Sea. One of the recent National Geographic Magazines has an excellent article on this. I don't believe that there is a corruption of facts from one tale to another...it's just that a flood metaphor is a universal archetypal belief based both on legends based on actual events, combined with the human psyche's inner dramas of purging & the rebirth of the earth.  |
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Date: 8/19/2000 6:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 177
....I think that more down to earth explanations can be found for the evolution of the languages of Man. Rather than angels coming down to confuse the tongues of Mankind, I think that non mythological explanations can be found for the variety of human languages. I sincerely believe that Man's languages evolved gradually over thousands of years of time. No need to call into reference an almighty God with a bad attitude toward the accomplishments & aspirations of the beings he created through evolution (spiritualy & physicaly). |
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Date: 8/19/2000 7:06:00 PM
From Authorid: 177
I guess you could say that I am a person somewhere between being a skeptic of the paranormal & the mythological, yet admitting that there is much anecdotal evedence that supports the "supernatural". While many of my beliefs might be labled, by some, to be New Age...I also "choke" on fables of Atlantis, Mu, Ancient Astronauts, etc, etc., (which are often incorporated into New Age thought) as much as I "gag" on what I consider the myths of the Bible. I find myths to be fascinating in themselves, but I find myself diverging considerably from both Christian Fundamentalism (which I was raised on) as well as some of the New Age concepts that have attracted me. I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but I think I'm trying to say that I love the mystery of it all. I do not deny that I may be wrong in much of what I believe, yet I am not willing to be intimidated by dire verses from the Bible...promissing dam#ation to those who walk a different path. Kindest regards, |
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Date: 8/19/2000 8:55:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
thats ok tc its a free world; we usally do the most damage to ourselves.we may not need god but we know that God does not need us{thus his Love is proven} now science has proven that all language goes back to just one comman language as does the genes of man go back to just one mother they aptly named EVE.TC what denomination were you church of christ? or mormon? |
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Date: 8/19/2000 8:56:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
'When all men were of one language, some of them built a high tower, as if they would thereby ascend up to heaven; but the gods sent storms of wind and overthrew the tower, and gave everyone his peculiar language; and for this reason it was that the city was called Babylon....After this they were dispersed abroad, on account of their languages, and went out by colonies everywhere; and each colony took possession of that land which they lighted upon, and unto which God led them; so that the whole continent was filled with them, both the inland and maritime countries. There were some also who passed over the sea in ships, and inhabited the islands; and some of these nations do still retain the names which were given to them by their first founders; but some also have lost them...The Sybil (Josephus. Antiq. i. 5.) |
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Date: 8/19/2000 9:01:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
I have this book and have found parts of it on the internet so I am posting this portion in hope that it gives a clear picture of the people who came off the ark and populated the world that we know today. RANGERIDER>>>>>>>>>>>>> When Noah and his family stepped out of the Ark, they were the only people on Earth. It fell to Noah’s three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth, and their wives, to repopulate the earth through the children that were born to them after the Flood. Of Noah’s grandchildren, 16 grandsons are named in Genesis chapter 10. God has left us ample evidence to confirm that these 16 grandsons of Noah really lived, that the names the Bible gives were their exact names, and that after the Babel dispersion (Genesis 11) their descendants fanned out over the earth and established the various nations of the ancient world. The first generations after the Flood lived to be very old, with some men outliving their children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren. This set them apart. The 16 grandsons of Noah were the heads of their family clans, which became large populations in their respective areas. Several things happened: 1.People in various areas called themselves by the name of the man who was their common ancestor. 2.They called their land, and often their major city and major river, by his name. 3.Sometimes the various nations fell off into ancestor worship. When this happened, it was natural for them to name their god after the man who was ancestor of all of them, or to claim their long-living ancestor as their god. All of this means that the evidence has been preserved in a way that can never be lost, and all the ingenuity of man cannot erase. We will now examine it. The seven sons of Japheth Genesis 10:1–2 reads: ‘Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood. The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras.’ The first of Noah’s grandsons mentioned is Gomer. Ezekiel locates the early descendants of Gomer, along with Togarmah (a son of Gomer), in the north quarters (Ezekiel 38:6). In modern Turkey is an area which in New Testament times was called Galatia. The Jewish historian Flavius Josephus records that the people who were called Galatians or Gauls in his day (c. AD 93) were previously called Gomerites.1 They migrated westward to what are now called France and Spain. For many centuries France was called Gaul, after the descendants of Gomer. North-west Spain is called Galicia to this day. Some of the Gomerites migrated further to what is now called Wales. The Welsh historian, Davis, records a traditional Welsh belief that the descendants of Gomer ‘landed on the Isle of Britain from France, about three hundred years after the flood’.2 He also records that the Welsh language is called Gomeraeg (after their ancestor Gomer). Other members of their clan settled along the way, including in Armenia. The sons of Gomer were ‘Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah’ (Genesis 10:3). Encyclopaedia Britannica says that the Armenians traditionally claim to be descended from Togarmah and Ashkenaz.3 Ancient Armenia reached into Turkey. The name Turkey probably comes from Togarmah. Others of them migrated to Germany. Ashkenaz is the Hebrew word for Germany. The next grandson mentioned is Magog. According to Ezekiel, Magog lived in the north parts (Ezekiel 38:15, 39  ). Josephus records that those whom he called Magogites, the Greeks calledScythians.1 According to Encyclopædia Britannica, the ancient name for the region which now includes part of Romania and the Ukraine was Scythia.4 The next grandson is Madai. Along with Shem’s son Elam, Madai is the ancestor of our modern-day Iranians. Josephus says that the descendants of Madai were called Medes by the Greeks.1 Every time the Medes are mentioned in the Old Testament, the word used is the Hebrew word Madai (maday). After the time of Cyrus, the Medes are always (with one exception) mentioned along with the Persians. They became one kingdom with one law — ‘the law of the Medes and Persians’ (Daniel 6  , 12, 15). Later they were simply called Persians. Since 1935they have called their country Iran. The Medes also ‘settled India’.5 The name of the next grandson, Javan, is the Hebrew word for Greece. Greece, Grecia, or Grecians appears five times in the Old Testament, and is always the Hebrew word Javan. Daniel refers to ‘the king of Grecia’ (Daniel 8 1), literally ‘the king of Javan’. Javan’s sons were Elishah,Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim (Genesis 10:4), all of whom have connections with the Greek people. The Elysians (an ancient Greek people) obviously received their name from Elishah. Tarshish or Tarsus was located in the region of Cilicia (modern Turkey). Encyclopædia Britannica says that Kittim is the biblical name for Cyprus.6 The Greeks worshipped Jupiter under the name of Jupiter Dodanaeus, possibly a reference to the fourth son of Javan, with Jupiter a derivative of Japheth. His oracle was at Dodena. Next is Tubal. Ezekiel mentions him along with Gog and Meshech (Ezekiel 39:1). Tiglath-pileser I, king of Assyria in about 1100 BC, refers to the descendants of Tubal as the Tabali. Josephus recorded their name as the Thobelites, who were later known as Iberes.1 ‘Their land, in Josephus’ day, was called by the Romans Iberia, and covered what is now (the former Soviet State of) Georgia whose capital to this day bears the name Tubal as Tbilisi. From here, having crossed the Caucasus mountains, this people migrated due north-east, giving their tribal name to the river Tobol, and hence to the famous city of Tobolsk.’7 Meshech, the name of the next grandson, is the ancient name for Moscow. Moscow is both the capital of Russia, and the region that surrounds the city. To this day, one section, the Meschera Lowland, still carries the name of Meshech, virtually unchanged by the ages. According to Josephus, the descendants of grandson Tiras were called Thirasians. The Greeks changed their name to Thracians.1 Thrace reached from Macedonia on the south to the Danube River on the north to the Black Sea on the east. It took in much of what became Yugoslavia. World Book Encyclopedia says: ‘The people of Thrace were savage Indo-Europeans, who liked warfare and looting.’8 Tiras was worshipped by his descendants as Thuras, or Thor, the god of thunder. The four sons of Ham Next we come to the sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Phut, and Canaan (Genesis 10:6). The descendants of Ham live mainly in south-west Asia and Africa. The Bible often refers to Africa as the land of Ham (Psalms 105 3,27; 1062). The name of Noah’s grandson Cush is theHebrew word for old Ethiopia (from Aswan south to Khartoum). Without exception, the word Ethiopia in the English Bible is always a translation of the Hebrew word Cush. Josephus rendered the name as Chus, and says that the Ethiopians ‘are even at this day, both by themselves and by all men in Asia, called Chusites’.9 Noah’s next grandson mentioned was Mizraim. Mizraim is the Hebrew word for Egypt. The name Egypt appears hundreds of times in the Old Testament and (with one exception) is always a translation of the word Mizraim. E.g. at the burial of Jacob, the Canaanites observed the mourning of the Egyptians and so called the place Abel Mizraim (Genesis 50:11). Phut, the name of Noah’s next grandson is the Hebrew name for Libya. It is so translated three times in the Old Testament. The ancient river Phut was in Libya. By Daniel’s day, the name had been changed to Libya (Daniel 11:43). Josephus says, ‘Phut also was the founder of Libia [sic], and called the inhabitants Phutites, from himself’.9 Canaan, the name of Noah’s next grandson, is the Hebrew name for the general region later called by the Romans Palestine, i.e. modern Israel and Jordan. Here we should look briefly at a few of the descendants of Ham (Genesis 10:14–18). There is Philistim, obviously the ancestor of the Philistines (clearly giving rise to the name Palestine), and Sidon, the founder of the ancient city that bears his name, and Heth, the patriarch of the ancient Hittite empire. Also, this descendant is listed in Genesis 10:15–18 as being the ancestor of the Jebusites (Jebus was the ancient name for Jerusalem — Judges 19:10), the Amorites, the Girgasites, the Hivites, the Arkites, the Sinites, the Arvadites, the Zemarites, and the Hamathites, ancient peoples who lived in the land of Canaan. The most prominent descendant of Ham was Nimrod, the founder of Babel (Babylon), as well as of Erech, Accad and Calneh in Shinar (Babylonia). The five sons of Shem Last we come to the sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram (Genesis 10 2). Elam is the ancient name for Persia, which is itself the ancient name for Iran. Until the time of Cyrus the people here were called Elamites, and they were still often called that even in New Testament times. In Acts 2  , the Jews from Persia who were present at Pentecost were calledElamites. The Persians are thus descended from both Elam, the son of Shem, and from Madai, the son of Japheth (see above). Since the 1930s they have called their country Iran. It is interesting to note that the word ‘Aryan’, which so fascinated Adolf Hitler, is a form of the word ‘Iran’. Hitler wanted to produce a pure Aryan ‘race’ of supermen. But the very term ‘Aryan’ signifies a mixed line of Semites and Japhethites! Asshur is the Hebrew word for Assyria. Assyria was one of the great ancient empires. Every time the words Assyria or Assyrian appear in the Old Testament, they are translated from the word Asshur. He was worshipped by his descendants. ‘Indeed, as long as Assyria lasted, that is until 612 BC, accounts of battles, diplomatic affairs and foreign bulletins were daily read out to his image; and every Assyrian king held that he wore the crown only with the express permission of Asshur’s deified ghost.’10 Arphaxad was the progenitor of the Chaldeans. This ‘is confirmed by the Hurrian (Nuzi) tablets, which render the name as Arip-hurra — the founder of Chaldea.’11 His descendant, Eber, gave his name to the Hebrew people via the line of Eber-Peleg-Reu-Serug-Nahor-Terah-Abram (Genesis 11:16–26). Eber’s other son, Joktan, had 13 sons (Genesis 10 6–30), all of whom appear to havesettled in Arabia.12 Lud was the ancestor of the Lydians. Lydia was in what is now Western Turkey. Their capital was Sardis — one of the seven churches of Asia was at Sardis (Revelation 3:1). Aram is the Hebrew word for Syria. Whenever the word Syria appears in the Old Testament it is a translation of the word Aram. The Syrians call themselves Arameans, and their language is called Aramaic. Before the spread of the Greek Empire, Aramaic was the international language (2 Kings 18 6 ff). On the cross, when Jesus cried out, ‘Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani’ (Mark 15:34),13 Hewas speaking Aramaic, the language of the common people. Conclusion We have only taken the briefest glance at Noah’s sixteen grandsons,14 but enough has been said to show that they really did live, that they were who the Bible says they were, and that their descendants are identifiable on the pages of history. Not only is the Bible not a collection of myths and legends, but it stands alone as the key to the history of the earliest ages of the world. |
| Date: 8/19/2000 10:30:00 PM From Authorid: 14067 This is really informative, and its good that you took the time to post this! I enjoyed this very much. ~~JoeJoe~~ |
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Date: 8/20/2000 8:12:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
thanks JJ. |
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Date: 8/22/2000 7:22:00 AM
From Authorid: 11240
Rangerider, what do you think today's scientific world would do if a person was presented to them claiming "all names," i.e., blood relation to every human that has lived, is living, or will be born? Would they be secretative about such a thing? And, if so, for what reason? For if such a person existed wouldn't this give new meaning to the concept of "love thy brother" in the sense that, if everyone is commonly related, to harm ANYONE (by war, by political suppression, by murder, etc.) would be the same as harming one's own brother? God Bless. Deb |
| Date: 8/23/2000 11:25:00 AM I am missing because I cannot get logged on. was my password revoked? I do not know I am working on it. Rangerider |
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Date: 8/23/2000 6:53:00 PM
From Authorid: 11211
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. Hurry Back. Love and Prayers. Whitedove. |
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Date: 8/24/2000 11:08:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
thanks whitedove for that verse. Ihs |
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Date: 8/24/2000 1:22:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
hi Deb this is what Jesus taught. we are to love one another or our brother. tracing through blood, genetic and linguistics all trace beck to one Adam and One Eve but not he ones from the bible; no it is the Adam and Eve of evolution according to the scientists.. |
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Date: 8/25/2000 8:23:00 AM
From Authorid: 160
RR? You have managed to get your self lost and found in cyberspace, write more stories and have sidestepped my questions. Care to respond??? |
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Date: 8/25/2000 10:16:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
no pammyjo why would you expect to, since they were involved in false worship, isnt that why they were dispersed? what they were doing is forming poytheism "just a step above pantheism" and that is seen by the reserch or the worship of more then one God but many now believe that one God was the first form of worship before the flood and just afterwards, just the reverse of what scientists though it was before 1960. |
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Date: 8/25/2000 10:21:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
better clarify that statement above. what secular researchers thought was that pantheism developed first leading off into polytheism and on up into theism and monotheism. by the way let me ask you a question. How old do you think the earth is? how old do the Jehovahs witnesses watchtower society say it is? |
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Date: 8/25/2000 10:22:00 AM
From Authorid: 160
I asked you if any of your research concerning the trinity found links to that time period before the babel cofusion. Because evidence shows that people took with them their false worship, to their final destination. If you look hard enough you will find "trinity' in many religions. How did that happen,Thats what I want to know and if you found any reference to this in your research? |
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Date: 8/25/2000 10:26:00 AM
From Authorid: 160
I dont think I'm going to fall into that trap. I dont know how old the earth is I do not however believe that "carbon Dating' is an exact science and have serious doubts that the earth is as old as they say it is. That is my opinion and not the societies. We know that Adam was created about 6,000 years ago. So mankind has been around at least that long. It makes sence to me. |
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Date: 8/25/2000 11:26:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
me to, i was just wondering and it wasn't a trap. I think I answered you question about the trinity. you said>>>>>>If you look hard enough you will find "trinity' in many religions.<<<<<<<<<<<could you please explain that and show me some of the religions and the trinity. it is my understanding that only christains use the truine God concept and everything else is polytheistic or monotheistic or pantheist |
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Date: 8/25/2000 12:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 160
Ya know what RR? I'm not going to sit here for an hour and do all the research and type it out for it to go nowhere. I know I started this so I'm just going to say that I was trying to show you how the trinity has it's roots imbedded in babels false teachings. In one of your stories concerning the subject, one of the witches said that they have a similar teaching. Something like maiden, mother, crone. I thought that was interesting. Just wanted to know if you caught it and what your thoughts are on the matter. |
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Date: 8/25/2000 1:44:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 4902
well pammyjo I do a lot of typing too and I remember vaugely what you are saying but I did not follow up on it. besides I have no problem with the triune Godhead. it has not hindered my prayer. |
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Date: 8/26/2000 3:34:00 PM
From Authorid: 177
I was raised in a no name fundamentalist group who consider themselves a continuation/or revival of the early church. They don't believe in church buildings, (they meet in private homes), seminary shools; the ministers go out "two by two" (which is what many outsiders call them). They consider themselves the one true church, & the only one that can claim to rightfully be called christian. |
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