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Date: 2/19/2001 10:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 15070
*sorry*, not gonna go there..........*smiles*  |
| Date: 2/19/2001 10:10:00 PM From Authorid: 24315 what exactly do the wiccians believe?~WiLd1~ |
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Date: 2/19/2001 10:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 15070
#24315 there are SEVERAL excellent posts here on USM about the Wiccan faith.check SEARCH STORIES..... |
Date: 2/19/2001 10:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 15621
Well,we believe like this...LOL......I have no idea myself FB...I hope someone helps you out  |
Date: 2/19/2001 10:37:00 PM
From Authorid: 17516
Interesting question. Well let me tell you what I think because I have been thinking about this ALOT lately. As you may know ~wink~ I have rejected the bible and the bible god because of how illogical it all is (see my posts for more info), yet I still express a belief in god. But I am coming to realize that I have no logical reason for this either. I may just have to give it up. Love,  |
Date: 2/19/2001 10:51:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Hey guys how ya doing, sixgun, karma, havent seen ya for awhile, hopefully I'll have more time tomorrow. Lsg, you dont have to go there, I just thought someone could explain the hows and whys of why they thought their path was correct or truth. I have often explained why I thought my path was correct or the truth, this isnt in debate, not need to be frightened of me fighting anyone on their answers. *hugs*  |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:02:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Hiya, F.B., *hugs, indulging in my hobby* Adventurers exploring a new land usually do not know what the destination is until they arrive there. ... Our spirits are like those adventurers and the strange land is human existence. ... You are confusing religious doctrine with "faith" *IMHO*... God cannot be confined to words. ... *hugs, indulging in my hobby* May peace and harmony be forever yours. /s/ J.T. |
Date: 2/19/2001 11:03:00 PM
From Authorid: 19332
have been wondering the same thing,I know us christians have our reasons to beleave in what we do.Out of couriosity,why do you beleave like you do?I'm sure there has to be a reason that people beleave in a goddess.Demon Slayer |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:04:00 PM
From Authorid: 19332
oops,I meant I have been wondering the same thing.Demon Slayer |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:08:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Hiya, Demon Slayer, *sigh* if you are talking to me, please read about eighty percent of my stories. They are all related to why I am no longer a Christian. If you are not talking to me, I will just go back to sleep... *snore*... *smile*... May peace and harmony be forever yours. /s/ J.T. |
Date: 2/19/2001 11:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 3321
Just because the Bible exists does not mean it exudes truths. It is a "truth" for a Christian, but not for anyone else. We have our own "truths" as every religion does. The thought that Christianity is not the only fulfilling religion seems not to have crossed your mind, either way, I have my faith in the Goddess and God, and only to know how long Paganism has been around is enough for me, just as the bible seems to be enough for you...  |
Date: 2/19/2001 11:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 177
We live, we die. We continue rolling along with the Wheel of Karma, being reborn to face karmic challenges and debts, until we get to the point where we can become freed from this "wheel". We then continue evolving in the non-physical realms, until we can reunite with God, of whom we are part of, even now, and to whom (our goal is) to be reunited with.  |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:12:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Yes J.t but they say that wicca is a religion, so I'm asking on that basis. To author only, I agree with you 3000% loves ya. |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:13:00 PM
From Authorid: 3321
Oh yeah *hugs* :) As I am sure you well know, faith is a lot to do with feeling and a sense of belonging and knowing. I do not belong as a Christian, I belong with the Goddess, this I know. TO simply direct it at us, should not be so....this is something that should be directed at everyone of every religion..... |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:16:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Hiya, F.B., and *although I follow no manmade religion* my answer applies to all beliefs, even yours. ... Just because you put your faith in the corrupt words of men does not mean that you are wrong, it is the path you have chosen. ... We all choose our own paths, regardless what excuse or reason we claim. *smile*... May peace and harmony be forever yours. /s/ J.T. |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:21:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Perse I agree with you on that, I'm not just directing it at the wicca, but Ihavent seen any deist come forward and this question has been asked of Christians many times over. We have told you our beliefs and I cant ever once see anything that backs up why the wicca believe what they believe. I cant see anything wrong with the question as If I were someone that wasnt sure of my faith and wanted to read on differnt religions and find out why they have faith in this or what causes them to have faith in this, well I would want to know. This is why I asked the question so that maybe I could find out if there is some book from way back in history or something such as this that might give them the belief that they have and also as far as deist go, I wonder why or how they can live life without anything really to hang on to. I mean wicca has god/goddess what do deist have? Or even an athesit? This is not in debate, I do not want to debate, I just want to have a little knowledge about this. thanks for stopping by. |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:25:00 PM
From Authorid: 19332
acually J.T. I was wanting to hear from just about anyone that would let me know.thanks for the info,I will go check some of your posts out.Demon Slayer |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:32:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Here you go, F.B., an excerpt from the Encyclopedia Britannica, RE: Deism: "The proponents of natural religion were strongly influenced by three intellectual concerns: a growing faith in human reason, a distrust of religious claims of revelation that lead to dogmatism and intolerance, and, finally, an image of God as the rational architect of an ordered world." ... To me, "Deism" is merely a word, it is not a "religion" nor does it outline a set of rules to follow. It is recognition of God and his ability to design a universe that runs by itself without his constant *ly changing* intervention. ... Makes more sense to me than a God who made mistakes and continues to make mistakes requiring disasters, miracles or revelations to compensate for his incompetence. ... I do not need something to "hand on to" since God gave me everything I needed before I left home to explore this life. ... People who have "faith" do not need something to "hang on to." *IMHO*... *smile*... /s/ J.T. |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:36:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 oops, TYPO ALERT: "hang on to" instead of "hand on to" ... sorry... *blush*... Demon Slayer, my motto is "Believe what you will." ... As I said to your mom, we all have our own paths, it is not within my authority to tell anyone which path to choose... That is between them and God (s), Goddess (es), their conscious, or nothing, whichever they prefer... *smile*... /s/ J.T. |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:46:00 PM
From Authorid: 18737
And here are a couple of noted "Deists:" "The first three presidents of the United States all subscribed to Deist beliefs." (Encyclopedia Britannica, Deism) ... *smile*... /s/J.T. Tools E-mail this article Print this article More About This Topic Article Index Entry Internet Links Summary |
| Date: 2/19/2001 11:48:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Please disregard everything past J.T. in the above ^^^, it's getting late... *yawn, sigh*... *smile*... /s/ J.T. |
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Date: 2/19/2001 11:52:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thanks for the info j>T> What I mean about hang on to, while I have faith, its nice to know that my faith gives me something to look forward to in the after life. One other thing, man made words can go for all paths, as no one can prove God, except within themselves, just as no one can prove god/godess, or what ever religion except with in themselves. Its just my religion has a book to follow along with the one on one relationship to God and I was wondering if anyone else out their in their religion had any such book or something like this that helps point the way or the reason behind their faith. |
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Date: 2/20/2001 12:06:00 AM
From Authorid: 3321
In Witchcraft, we have ancient belief systems passed down by mouth, as well as certain manuscripts and various things from medeival times....Paganism and The Craft have been around a very very very long time...no book needed. |
| Date: 2/20/2001 12:07:00 AM From Authorid: 18737 Why would you prefer the corrupt words of men over God's truth? That really does confuse me when you *and others* refer to God's words and then start quoting men *or women*... The God you follow is might weak if he requires men to speak for him. ... F.B., God speaks to everyone of us *IMHO*... but, we usually don't listen... *smile*... Regardless where you get the information... *smile* ... /s/ J.T. |
| Date: 2/20/2001 12:09:00 AM From Authorid: 18737 F.B., I believe in "reincarnation" and the eternity of the soul. I do NOT believe the soul was "born" or "dies." ... ONLY flesh dies *actually it recycles into the earth*... Our spirits are not perishable, regardless what your preacher says *or wherever you get that idea*... *smile*... /s/ J.T. |
| Date: 2/20/2001 12:13:00 AM From Authorid: 18737 F.B., If I "hang on" to anything, it is the idea that this too shall pass and one day, I will be free of this body and soaring throughout the universe as a free spirit, once again enjoying my freedom. ... *smile*... and in the meantime, enjoying every sensation I can in this realm, no matter how horrible it may seem, I know that one day, I will look back and laugh when I realize how trivial life's "problems" are... *sigh*... And they really are... *smile* ... /s/ J.T. |
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Date: 2/20/2001 12:49:00 AM
From Authorid: 177
If the He##-fire believers are truly loving people, they will rejoice in the here-after when they see that people of all religions, or no religion, are there with them. They will learn to appreciate that it was not religion, or doctrine, that mattered, but simply one's actions and attitudes in life. |
Date: 2/20/2001 3:24:00 AM
From Authorid: 23610
Hiya Firstborn. Glad you're back! Well, I'm not Wiccan. In fact I not anything with a label. I have to agree with Karma Killer's comment. I too have rejected the Bible as being completely true. I do think it is a good book and a resource for finding peace and calm when needed. But, having read the Bible in its entirety...I have found so many inconsistencies in it along with so much anger, fear, and hate...that it just does not "feel" right to my spirit. I have also studied history enough to know how the Bible has been manipulated by the Catholic church in times when the Catholic church had power and was involved with government and control of people. The God that I know is so very kind, uconditionally loving, and forgiving...that I just cannot accept the fear that is proposed in the Bible. I believe that fear is the opposite of love and I do not believe that God would want me to fear him....especially as he knows that would only in reality distance me from him. Jesus did not teach fear, hatred, or bigotry. He accepted all people and loved unconditionally. Every organized religion I have attended has spouted fear from the pulpit. Even when praying, when asking forgiveness for their sins, they still say, "I know I am not worthy". I cannot accept that. God has taught me that I am his daughter and I sure am worthy. I brought this up to a rector at the church my husband attends and I some times attend with him...and the rector said..."Oh, of course we are all worthy." When I asked him why then in their prayers do they teach people to say, "I am not worthy"...he said..."Oh, that's just tradition." It was so illogical to me...and I could not understand why then if they did not believe those words to be true would they be teaching the people of their congregation to say it over and over again in their prayers. There is just too much confusion and contradiction in organized religion to me. I have chosen to search for God and the truth on my own past...that way if I make a mistake...at least it is my mistake...and not one I am making by simply following someone else. I have found that I am so much more happy and so much more compassionate and understanding on the path that I am on. I do not judge others (of course I am human and do sometimes fall viction to that though) and I am far more able to let people make their own mistakes and see it as a learning tool and a step towards progression and growth of the spirit. Does any of this makes sense...I fear I am rambling. LOL. *hugs and love my friend* -Lady Nyx  |
Date: 2/20/2001 5:57:00 AM
From Authorid: 21249
I have to say as a child attending church regularly, I was frightened, as they yelled down hell fire from the pulpit,I came away every Sunday feeling ashamed of myself and unworthy, I to have found many inconcistensies the Bible yet some is calming and soothing,I fought a battle inside myself for many year's, I finally followed my heart and said,,,"I believe in the creator, I believe he would not want to frighten me, and I saw him as a loving God and a Forgiving God and a God who loved unconditonally,this God was the God I chose, I may not live in all way's by the bible but I have tremondous Faith and God has proven to me many thing's in many form's, so at last I am at peace with God and know's that he does not judge me, because of free will,Now free "Will" you could take that to mean alot of different thing's, I see it, that we may experience life in the fullest, without feeling that God will smite me down, and I fear his rath.So I hope I did not offend anyone, that was not my intention, I respect all religion's and all belief's, some I even learn from, so thankyou for this post love jollee  |
Date: 2/20/2001 6:03:00 AM
From Authorid: 21714
OK I am so confused here. Your relationship with your God or Goddess needs to be your business. Its a relationship that is very personal and needs to be treated in the same manner as you would any personal relationship. I dont mean to sound insulting, but a lot of comments here sound like a bunch of kids saying" my dad is better than yours" What ever buisness you have with any God of any Religion (or Goddess) I think Should not be paraded about. In most religeons I am familiar with, The relationship with the Diety is a special one... and can even at times be described as intimate. So like I said, Those types of relationships should be kept private and to yourself. Take care,  |
Date: 2/20/2001 11:01:00 AM
From Authorid: 11428
It is basic faith. I have had an experience with the Goddess and that is what I believe. Not to offend but if the Bible was never made would you still believe in you religion? Prophacy  |
| Date: 2/20/2001 11:25:00 AM From Authorid: 16245 Lady Nyx and Jollee said it all for me. I think that all of us that have walked away from the constant put-downs and criticism have a closer and more personal connection with our maker than we did when we followed the Church. I was left with constant feelings of confusion, unworthiness and guilt. I spent 99% of my life going to Church and attending Catholic schools. I even worked at a Church for a couple of years. I was disgusted at what I saw, the hypocrisy and the "double standards". Rules applied only to certain people while others seem "immune" or had their own speical rules. I now follow what is in my heart and there is nobody that can tell me it's wrong. My God is personal to me and I don't need a book, statutes or a building to tell me of his/her existance. Just look at the sky, the earth, trees, birds etc. that is enough for me. PEACE |
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Date: 2/20/2001 2:09:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thanks perse, I dont know the names of the manuscripts that your talking about but it would be interesting reading. J.T. Even you apparently believe the writings of man as your Bible, * britancia * was written by man, not my words just words of a friend. LOL But I agree with them. J>T> also , I never said anything dies *except* the flesh, the rest goes on for eternity. TC, yes I'm a hell fire believer and I would rejoice more than you could ever know if all that I think that are going to hell, didnt. NOTHING would PLEASE me more, I would love to be wrong about that part of it, but I dont believe that I'm. |
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Date: 2/20/2001 2:12:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
LadyNxy, Jollee, so much damage can be done by churches. I know that there are good ones, but there are also many bad ones, which to preach that everything you do is wrong and your not worthy, to me this is hog wash, they should be preaching the love of God and the power and authoirity given the believer to help other on earth. I'm sorry ya'll had to experience stuff like that, this stuff also kept me out of churches for many many years. |
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Date: 2/20/2001 2:18:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Well tgyyyyyyyy or what ever that says, or should I just call you phoenix? LOL My God says to confess the name of Jesus to all men. To glorify His name and so that is what I try to do. Prophacy, I dont believe in religion, I believe in God and believed in God and jesus before I ever read the Bible, so my answer is Yes, I would still believe. Peace, you, ladynxy and jollee are right, One gets tired of the feeling of unworthyness that the church puts on its people. Not all churches are like this, I went to a full gospel or what they call a non-denominational church. For the most part they were good. I want to thank you all for your comments. |
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Date: 2/20/2001 4:59:00 PM
From Authorid: 21714
You and I share similarities in the same religion, and yes you are right in saying to confess his name to all men.... but that doesnt mean to go around telling everyone you meet about him. Frankly, that is annoying and most people are turned away by that. What is meant by confessing his name is to not be ashamed to tell people that he is a significant part of your life. Christians in the past were persecuted for worshiping him, so many of them kept silent about it.. jesus said do not be ashamed to tell people about him, and to confess his name to all men, and that your rewards in heaven will be great. Basically all he was saying was if some one comes up to you and says "hey, if you say you are a christian, you are going to die", Then do not say no just to save your butt. There also are many refrences in jesus' teachings that say that when you pray, do it in solitude. This supports my statement that it is a private matter between you and God. And if you think what I said above conflicts with "witnessing", think again. Jesus said in all things you do, do it for the glory of God. Your actions should reflect your faith. Therefore, you witness to people by your actions. They should see Jesus in you. Next, Does questioning the validity/faith/actions/beliefs others have in their religions glorify the name of God? If you ask me, I would see that as an attemp (indirectly) to weaken my faith, if I were of another religion. And finally. We are to glorify the name of God in everything we do. Not what we say. You tell more people about you by the things you do. not what you say. its just like being in love. People know you are in love by the things you do. It is quite offensive to go discussing the details of your love life ( and i mean all respects of the word love). The Partner would find it offensive, no? Its the same with God. just like I said about prayer, keep it between you and him. every one else will see the love of that relationship in you. Take Care, T-Y-G-r-r-r-r.... |
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Date: 2/20/2001 5:56:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
TGRRRRRRRRRRR I disagree with you on a point or two. One being that we are to preach the gospel of Jesus. That is my most important disagreement. If someone said, denouce Christ or die, then I would die because I will not denouce Jesus. About prayer read about it in Acts, where they, the deciples prayed in one accord. There are times for praying in one accord as the Bible teaches that there is power in united prayer, there are times to pray in your private room, and pray just between you and God. Just as there are times to pray in the spirit and times to pray in your own tounge. There are differnt kinds of prayer as well as differnt times to pray differently. So its a matter of discerning what you need to do when and always do what the Lord would lead you into doing. Many in older times were affraid to admit to knowing Jesus or they would be killed. If asked they would not deny Him, but kind of kept it under their hats otherwise. Just like some are affraid to tell anyone they are a witch because of strange hatefull people out there but I think that if one is commintted to their Lord then they are not ashamed of the Gospel of Jesus or His name. I'm not saying that you are this, I'm just pointing out a place or do that we think differntly. God bless you. M'r:16:15: And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. Lu:4:18: The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, Ro:1:15: So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also. Ro:10:15: And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! 1Co:9:16: For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel! 1Co:9:18: What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel. 2Tm:4:2: Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. |
Date: 2/20/2001 7:25:00 PM
From Authorid: 11091
OK, FirstBorn I am not included, but I will comment. I am an atheist and I believe in the individaul, society, and humanity. My goals in life are to do that which is right, all others to follow their choosen path as long as it harms none, and to leave the world a better place than it was when I came. I believe when I die my body will decompose and return to the earth and probably become fertilizer, and then go into a planet, and then get eaten by a small animal, and then a bigger animal, and so on.  |
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Date: 2/20/2001 8:09:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
thanks birdfeeder, that quite a plan!!! |
| Date: 2/20/2001 9:15:00 PM From Authorid: 18737 Hiya, F.B., *hugs, indulging in my hobby* the BIG DIFFERENCE is that I don't worship the publishers of the Encyclopedia Britannica. At least those words make sense without invoking magic. *smile*... May peace and harmony be forever yours. /s/ J.T. |
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Date: 2/22/2001 4:06:00 AM
From Authorid: 28148
Heh heh, I should have had your little footnote at the end of my first 2 posts. Real interesting stuff FirstBorn. Should have maybe read it before opening my mouth ;-) Rude |
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Date: 2/22/2001 5:42:00 AM
From Authorid: 21714
Firstborn, Mark 16: 9-20 sheds more light on the subject and brings a diffrent meaning to verse 9 which you quoted. Jesus spoke of those who believe will be able to drink deadly poison and not die, and be able to pick up deadly snakes.... These were Jesus' words to his desciples after he rose from the dead. Not to us... I am a believer and Ill be dang sure Im not going to be messing with no snakes or drinking poison. That message doesnt apply to us. The same goes for the rest of the scriptures.... you must read the whole passage. not just the verse. The meaning of the whole bible that exists before and after the verses you gave is completely changed. Romans chapter 1 is a letter from Paul (A Preacher called by god to educate christians) to the church of Rome. He said in that letter that he was coming to preach to the church cause the romans had the right motivation, Wrong Idea. Romans Chapter 10 Paul is talking about HIS duty as a preacher. In Timothy, he is giving words of encouragement to Timothy who is scared of his calling to be a Preacher. ! corinthians is another letter of Paul to the Church in Corinth Explaining His duties as a preacher, and how he makes a living at it. Nothing more.... The Bible is a history book on the Religion that you and I practice. It isnt a tool.. It wont fix anything, its not a rule book. There should be no point system in any personal relationship. Its not Gods word. Gods words are in it, but the Bible was written by man. Man has changed it to suit his needs over time (ie..King James???) Did you know that Mark 16 9-20 which you made refrence to, doesnt even exist in any reliable ancient text or witness???? Its the same for a lot of the bible. Thats why you have to listen to the word of God in your heart, and tell others about him through your actions. No body knows the EXACT words of god because he doesnt outright speak to us with words, and because of the foulability of man, No one knows if he ever really has. This is where Faith comes into play. The Bible is merely an inspiration. But if you would rather get scriptural, here it goes. Read 1 Thes. ch 1. Questioning others beliefs? read John ch. 12. Witness to others through actions, not words? Read 1 cor. ch.2, 2 cor ch. 2, Romans Ch. 1 (in particular, verse 20.) Luke ch. 4 (attn vs 24) The bible states all over that the words of man are foulable, but the ont thing that stays the constant in any religion is that you have to have faith. Just have faith in something. If you want it to ba in individual scripture, then more power to you.... i have mine.. I thank you for the discussion. Take care, |
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Date: 2/22/2001 9:21:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Tyggggr, I will not argue with you about God. Some believe one way some believe another way. I believe in Faith under Grace. AS for the snake and posion drink, IF something like that happened we could claim that verse that NOTHING would harm us, as far as doing it, drinking or playing with snakes on purpose, the bible also says, do not tempt the lOrd your God. |
| Date: 2/24/2001 1:51:00 AM From Authorid: 26631 Why do you always have to type about these subjects? do you really think that...oh wait you dont thats right! .......buh buy INFERNO |
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Date: 2/24/2001 9:09:00 AM
From Authorid: 21714
LMAO OMG...... |
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Date: 2/24/2001 10:34:00 AM
From Authorid: 17516
Here is the definition of a Troll: troll (trl) n. One who fishes by trailing bait from behind. Please do not feed the Trolls. It only encourages them. |
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Date: 2/24/2001 11:50:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
Howdy Karma. |
| Date: 2/25/2001 11:54:00 AM From Authorid: 26631 Karma...why do you keep giving the definition of your family life??? I am confused please clear this up...INFERNO |
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Date: 2/25/2001 12:44:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 16671
karma doesnt feed the trolls either. |
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